Moderator: Hello, audience friends. Welcome to this episode of Daily Heart to Heart Talk. I'm Ye Zhuang, the Moderator. As a Chinese psychologist, many parents always ask such a question that our children are very introverted and don't like dealing with others. Do you think there is something wrong with our children? If such children have problems, we will discuss them today. Today's guest is Xu Zhuo, a famous Chinese psychologist. Hello, Mr. Xu!

Guest: Hello, Ye Zhuang.

Host: Has anyone asked you about what I just said? Parents came to you hurriedly and said, "Ouch! Is my child not able to play with other people's peers now, especially introverted. Ouch! I am anxious to be a parent!" Has anyone asked you such a question?

Guest: Yes, and what was mentioned just now is very good! These three things are often mixed together. One is autistic, the other is shy, and the other is introverted. In fact, there are three possibilities. If you observe the child's behavior from a distance, you will feel that they are far behind. First of all, if it is really autism, it is a real disease, which needs to be diagnosed by the hospital. What is autistic? He actually has no access to the outside world! He doesn't even want to connect. He just lives in his own world and ignores it. And this shyness is that I really want to contact you, but I'm afraid of losing face after contacting you, or being laughed at by you, so I want to but dare not. So he controlled his own business. Yes, so one of the reasons why he is shy is that he has bad emotional experience, that is, negative emotional experience. On the other hand, he is actually an active withdrawal behavior. What is introversion? Introversion is actually a personality type. Let me give you a few examples. First of all, you know that I often give lectures and lectures. In fact, I live by speaking and writing with the outside world.

Host: Yes, I know that.

Guest: But actually I am an introvert.

Host: I don't know.

Guest: In fact, there are several different interpretations of introversion: what is the first one? He thinks that if you have a choice, you prefer to socialize, chat with others, or choose a place with many people, or you may choose to stay alone and read a book quietly, right? Or sometimes I just think about something there, but the current noun is "trance". So autism is a disease, and shyness is half a disease.

Host: So autism is a disease, and shyness is half a disease.

Guest: Yes! Or it is a problem that needs to be overcome. Introversion is a personality tendency.

Moderator: So introversion is a completely neutral word. Introversion itself is not defined or diagnostic.

Guest: Actually, it is the same as people like sweet food or spicy food. It serves as a description. Because introversion is actually a little like autistic. What? It has a physiological basis. I remember that the BBC once made such a documentary, which means that some people naturally like to be alone and stay quietly. For example, in a school, he must be a cheerleader in his class. If he is in a group, he must be the one who takes everyone out to play. What's the difference between these two kinds of people? They made a simple test of what kind: he divided two groups of people. In order to enlarge the data, they asked each team to find ten people, namely introverts and extroverts, and then asked them to

Compere: Are they all children?

Guest: adults

Moderator: Adults?

Guest: Yes, because this thing is not easy to change. What does it make them do? They lick a lemon by each person, so you will not secrete saliva. Then the next thing is a very long adhesive tape, but that paper is completely sanitary. After we lick the lemon, we take our own tongue to apply this tape, and see how long your group can apply the tape after you lick the lemon.

Compere: Is it a roll of tape that ten people use? Then the last one finishes the painting and the next one continues?

Guest: In fact, the tape is not long, so everyone actually applies more than one roll, just many rolls. It is finally piled up. Each of us just licks the lemon, and then you are more saliva secreting than this person. Of course, the tape is licked one roll after another. For people with little saliva, it will be easy soon, so you won't have to lick it again. What's the final result? For the introverted group, the number of tapes he licks is 40% more than that for the extroverted group.

Compere: So much?

Guest: Yes, why? In fact, what is introversion and extroversion? In fact, it is a matter of sensitivity. The same stimulation is to lick the lemon, but introverted people are very strong stimulation for them. I will stimulate a lot of saliva. For extroverts, licking the lemon is not enough, so you only secrete a little more. In terms of social intensity, for example, when you are in a bar, I can't stand it because it is too noisy and exciting. I hope there is a quiet bar, or a coffee shop, and give me a book. Even when talking, I usually want the volume to be slightly lower.

Host: So introversion and extroversion are a threshold problem.

Guest: Yes.

Compere: The threshold of introversion is here, and the threshold of extroversion will be higher.

Guest: Yes. So we can make a distinction in this way. In fact, inward and outward orientation is actually a sensitivity problem to stimulation.

Host: Well, I think introversion takes advantage! Introversion is better than extroversion. Why? Because you see I eat this food, I can't eat one steamed bun. I'm happy when I eat two steamed buns. If I am introverted, it will stimulate me greatly. If I eat a steamed bun, it will be enough. I may not have to be so fat today, which means that my fat may have something to do with being outgoing.

Guest: Maybe.

Host: Because it is true for this reason, because my threshold level needs more things to stimulate me. I am extroverted.

Guest: Actually, this topic is very important, so I would also recommend another book. The author of this book is Susan Cain. Susan Cain also gave a speech on TED. What's her name? Why did she write this book? In fact, as you just said, if I am introverted, I will take advantage of it? Because my threshold is low and I am sensitive, I will be happy if you give me a little. However, there is an era background. Now this era is an era of explosive overload of voice and information. That is to say, this era may be just as lively for outsiders, but for introverts, it is overwhelming. What are the forms of competitiveness and the competitiveness of the introverted personality that he emphasizes in his silence. In fact, she gave a rather obvious example: In many enterprises, I sometimes ask, if you are the president, for example, we are an enterprise that produces Internet APP. Now as the president, I have to ask my subordinates how to make a surprise victory when there are so many companies producing this APP. In fact, a little industry experts know that this problem is very complicated, and it can never be solved in one sentence or two. But on the contrary, if some people at the bottom would say, "Ouch! This problem is too complicated, I have to go back and look at some data, and I will think about it." But there was a man who stood up at once, and then faced your eyes with a smile, a firm smile. And I want to tell you that I think the reason why our company has been able to reach today. There is a better future in the future because of the following two points, and we need to do the other two points. How do you feel at this time?

Host: If I were the president, I would feel, wow! Is there such a person in my hand? I'm going to promote him!

Guest: In fact, this is a habit in modern society. He praises the person who seems to be very firm, speaks with a clear tongue, and speaks with great certainty. So this is an environment of a society. It is the current environmental design. You think that only people with loud voices can be heard because of its high noise.

Compere: The output of Alta signal is easier to recognize at this time.

Guest: Yes, in fact, the main environment of this modern society is conducive to the extroverts. Extraverted people are more easily appreciated in the company. Then, many introverts actually want to stay behind, for example. If you all want to express your opinions during the meeting, even if I feel immature, or even if I feel this unspoken desire, I will stand out, otherwise you will think that I am very uncooperative by contrast.

Host: Therefore, the present era is also more suitable for standing out from the crowd. However, if standing out from the crowd continues to develop, the trees will be beautiful in the forest and the wind will destroy it. If this person's extroverted performance is particularly good, he really stands out from the crowd. Will it increase his risk of frustration?

Guest: It's very possible, but what's the most serious problem I see? He will let everyone, in fact, have prudent thinking, but if your quick response and loud voice are the conditions that you are praised, then everyone will give up that prudent thinking.

Host: Oh, the bigger and faster the choice.

Guest: Yes, so my volume is more important than my sound quality. In this case, introverted people will suffer relatively, which may be the reason why many parents feel anxious just now. He will think that this introversion makes the child difficult to communicate with others or has something wrong.

Compere: In fact, it is totally different.

Guest: Yes, even teachers sometimes do this.

Host: Actually, the parents themselves are the victims. The values dominated by society lead to the wrong three values of upbringing, thinking that children should or must It's an extroverted type, but it doesn't have to be.

Guest: If I am introverted, I am actually quiet, slow in speaking, and cautious in expressing my opinions. When I saw that the social teacher also said that I had problems, my classmates were unwilling to answer me, and then my parents would take me to see a doctor, I might have to force myself out of my original preference.

Compere: But this is totally different from his real personality, so it will cause a series of consequences.

Guest: In fact, we all say to foster strengths and avoid weaknesses, but it is likely that the suppression of such mainstream voices leads people to believe that one is an advantage and the other is a disadvantage.

Moderator: If introversion is like this, parents are also worried about our children's shyness. You see, our children don't say hello to others. Anyway, how do you do it. The Tang poem I recited for my mother at home yesterday was very good. How could I recite it badly for Xu Dada. So what good tools or methods can we use for reference? 。

Guest: Actually, the biggest difference between shyness and introversion is one inside and one outside. This shyness is because I'm afraid that others will judge me badly, so you can see his upbringing environment from these two points. In fact, the statement you just simulated is very lifelike. Such a parent is actually putting a lot of pressure on his children. What is the hint that his parents left for the child at this stage? If the parents always have such an attitude towards their children, that is, if you are not good enough in the performance, you will not be worthy of my love. That's serious. It's serious for children. Yes, so you know that when I don't do it, I will not take the risk that it is not good enough. On the contrary, I am safe, because for children, the love and approval of parents are heaven. Right? Then my choice is that I may avoid the risk of taking the fall of the sky, and my other choice is to try this day may fall with serious consequences. At this time, any wise person will choose the former.

Moderator: Yes. Because the risk is too great. If this is the case, if a parent has imposed this kind of pressure on an introverted child for a long time, he or she will continue to push him or her outward, which is likely to cause a child's final growth path to go farther and farther from the end of the path he or she should have grown up. As a result, the child's own quality of life may be damaged.

Guest: Yes, this is a very serious phenomenon. In fact, many people, including adults, whose parents later asked me, for example Why are our children like this? There are some serious neurological problems, and some people even have mental problems.

Compere: This child has already grown up by this time, right?

Guest: Yes, there are children, teenagers and adults. Many times I would really tell him that this thing is random. It is the child's genes, his temperament, his upbringing environment and the current social environment he is facing. For example, this child may be inherently introverted and sensitive, and then his genes are like the six colors. It is not necessarily that his parents are introverted, so his parents may not be introverted, so their parents think this is a mistake. Or this is a problem that needs to be corrected, and he will think that you will suffer a lot in the future. If the child has problems, I will correct him. The result is that the child not only cannot develop at his own pace, but also there are many characters in his character, such as not being recognized, either fighting or repressing and escaping.

Host: So the last thing is that the parents and the child's normal growth path are locked in a stalemate. It is very likely that the child will be locked in a stalemate with himself in the later stages of life.

Guest: Yes, and then there will be some opportunities. Some people are more and more frustrated, but you really let me go back and push. You say that this person is because of his character or his genes. I don't know, but I know that in terms of statistical probability, some people may become stronger and stronger, while others may collapse for thousands of miles.

Compere: Is there any possibility that this child was quite introverted. Then the parents didn't realize that introversion was actually a normal orientation, and they had to try to break up the child in the direction of extroversion. The result is broken. Is there such a thing?

Guest: Yes, but what will I say. First of all, congratulations. Second, that actually proves the child. I don't know whether it is his genes or his parents' way of breaking up that causes his result to be good. For example, the child's genes may be more resilient (capricious.

Host: The result may be good, but there is still a big risk among them. You can't see that he has reached the end But you also have to know that you can't just watch the thief eat meat and not watch the thief get beaten, right? Mr. Xu, I found that there was a problem when we talked just now. I think it may be a mistake in my understanding, that is, I have been emphasizing that shyness and introversion are two different things, but I suddenly feel from your statement that these two things may have a huge intersection. Suppose we regard it as a plane rectangular coordinate system, one is shy, the other is introverted. It is possible for the colleague to take care of two of them, or neither of them, or one of them, without which it is possible. It is possible to assume that this person is introverted and shy, right? Maybe this person is extroverted and not shy. I think many people are like this. Of course, there are other people who may be shy and not introverted, introverted and not shy. Although it sounds like a tongue twister, I think how can we know these two if they intersect?

Guest: Actually, this question is very good. Both of them are continuous spectrum. They are not black or white, so it can be said that some people may be 40 shy, and then my extroversion may be 80. In that case, people may think that because 40 is less than 50, they may think that I am relatively extroverted and not shy. So it is true that there are different feelings and a different behavior in such a combination, and then he may have different ways to deal with events, such as what it means for a person to be shy and introverted. Being introverted means that I like being alone or having low stimulation. Being shy means that once I am not alone, I will have a very unpleasant experience. Then I will basically close myself. Now there is a good way for me to indulge in the online world.

Host: He doesn't have to face it.

Guest: First of all, you think if I am an outgoing and shy person, I am actually very contradictory, because being outgoing makes me willing to contact others to find excitement. But shyness also told me that contact with others will bring a lot of unhappiness. In fact, he is not consistent internally, that is, the more he wants to move forward, the more he wants to delay. But if I am introverted and shy, I know at least one thing. In fact, one thing I know is that I don't want to deal with people. I'm very comfortable in the shell. Another kind of person is not shy but introverted. I think this combination will be easier. I can be alone. But when you ask me to stand up, I don't have too much anxiety. Our ideal state is, Whether you are introverted or introverted, we still want to solve this shyness or at least reduce it to a lower level.

Host: In fact, we should have a more correct understanding of our introverted and extroverted tendencies. There is nothing to be ashamed of, whether extroverted or introverted He is a normal and healthy part of your personality. What we should focus on is a possible high level of shyness that we should deal with, right. That combined with the topic we talked about at the beginning, when one day a mother found a psychology student there and said, "Oh my child, I think he is very introverted. In fact, we got a better reference from Mr. Xu Zhuo, whether he is introverted or shy.". Because introversion is an indisputable thing, it is a part of others' personality.

Guest: Another thing to add is that introverts and extroverts may have different paths to deal with shyness at a high level. Why is it different? Because introverted people prefer to be alone. If they are shy, they are actually what we call the input-output ratio. For them, they are uncomfortable with other people's input-output. So in this case, we should first let him increase his good interpersonal interaction experience, and let him feel that the fear brought by this shyness is not so great. What is an extrovert? Someone is very active in the circle of acquaintances, and then he stops when he comes to the circle of strangers.

Compere: My wife is like this.

Guest: What may be different at this time is to give him a space or teach him some skills, rather than change his internal feelings, which is more important.

Compere: In the case of my wife, give her a space. This space refers to the space for more acquaintances or strangers.

Guest: A faster way is to introduce new people to her. For example, how many acquaintances do you have next to you.

Host: OK, let's talk about how to solve shyness and recognize introversion and introversion with Mr. Xu today. In the future, we will surely have Mr. Xu to talk with us about how to deal with those deeper shy experiences. Thank you for watching this episode of Daily Talk. See you next time.