Author | Li Haoran
Title | The Eight Heavenly Dragons
In the introduction on the Douban page, the writer Xinyuanping is a history lover, a "bone ash" level "Jin Yong fan" - a title full of sense of the times, which suddenly pulls people back more than ten years ago.
Since 2011, the Cambridge History of Slaying the Dragon against the Sky and Cambridge Concise History of Jin Yong's Swordsmen written by Xin Yuanping have been published successively. He has embedded 15 Jin Yong's Swordsman Novels into the Chinese historical context, using the most serious historical narrative style to describe the most ambitious fictional plot.
On the left is the Cambridge History of Heaven Reliance and Dragon Slaughtering, and on the right is the Cambridge Concise History of Jin Yong's Martial Arts.
In the book, the translation of Jin Yong's title into English and then into Chinese is one of the interests that "Jin Yong fans" understand. Between the gap between classical novels and the writing of Sinology, the Eight Heavenly Dragons became the War History between the Gods and the Dragons, the Divine Condor Heroes became the Romance of the Holy Condor, and the Smiling Proud Jianghu became the Smiling and Proud Wanderer on Rivers and Lakes.
Xinyuanping has a deep memory of a talk on the train in 2001. On the hard seat of the night train for returning home from winter vacation in college, he and a strange boy went from being silent to hating each other late, which originated from the sentence "Do you also see Jin Yong?".
Later, on the "Sword" section of Tianya Forum, he met more colleagues who were intoxicated with Jin Yong's martial arts world, and the idea of writing a book also formed quietly at that time.
August 14, 2022, Jilin City, Jilin Province. An internet anchor performed the unique skill of bamboo floating on the Songhua River. (Figure/IC)
The time train roared past, taking away too many familiar memories. More and more high-speed trains are replacing green trains, and they can also arrive every day thousands of miles away; With the great development of Internet and mobile communication technology, it is almost impossible to have in-depth conversations with strangers on the journey; Tianya Forum, the spiritual home of the first generation of netizens, also announced to stop service in 2023.
Three years ago, Xinyuanping made a speech in "Yixi" about the more unpopular "Yue Nv Sword" in Jin Yong's novel. A netizen said with emotion, "I haven't heard anyone mention Wuxia on such a formal occasion for a long time. Now even in major novel sites, Wuxia is also unpopular."
Xinyuanping also has a deep feeling about the ebb of the martial arts culture. Many of the contents that were once considered common sense need more explanation now. More often, he appeared under the pseudonym of "Baoshu" and wrote many science fiction works in more than ten years.
However, he still believes that Jin Yong's works are classics that can go through the time cycle. Recently, Xinyuanping is still making a comprehensive revision of his book, adding some new textual research results to prepare for the second edition.
On the occasion of Jin Yong's centennial birthday, we talked with Xinyuan about the past, present and future of the study of "Jinxue". The following is a dialogue between Xinyuanping and New Weekly.
The age of "Jinxue" in full bloom
New Weekly: The writing of Cambridge's History of Relying on the Sky and Killing the Dragon originated from your serial publication on the "Sword" section of Tianya Forum. What was the atmosphere of communication between Jin Yong's fans at that time?
Xinyuanping: It is generally a friendly atmosphere. Netizens often argue about certain topics, but "fans of Jin Yong" will not be very unhappy.
Everyone has their own ideas about the ranking of martial arts experts, which is more noisy. Some people will seriously work out some formulas, charts and other data to support it.
Although this debate is fierce, it does not involve real differences in positions, but adds a bit of interest. At the same time, everyone's ideas are also diverse. Some people are keen on creating peer novels or spoofing jokes, while others write some articles about current events that borrow the past and satirize the present, which are also related to the original book.
The "Cambridge style" I wrote is also inspired by other "fans of Jin Yong", who use the so-called western grammar and language to write the story of Jin Yong.
January 31, 2024, Hong Kong, China. The Jin Yong Museum is exhibiting cartoons based on Jin Yong's novels. (Picture/A Can)
New Weekly: In the Cambridge Concise History of Jin Yong's Swordsmen, you have made a textual research on the chronicles of "Laughing Proud Jianghu", "Swordsman's Journey", "Liancheng Jue", "White Horse Roaring West Wind" and "Mandarin Duck Blade", which are not clearly dated in Jin Yong's original works. In your opinion, what is the most difficult thing to integrate the narrative of 15 Jin Yong's martial arts novels into the framework of thousands of years of Chinese history?
Xin Yuanping: It is a hard job to do the textual research on the age of Jin Yong's novels, which requires a lot of effort. Since some of the original works do not mention the specific time, it is necessary to speculate according to the details in the text.
In addition, although Jin Yong's works are based on history, they do not strictly follow the historical framework, which is inconsistent with the real history. For example, in The Legend of Carving Heroes, when Genghis Khan held a conference on the river of mediation, Guo Jinggang made his debut, and then in the novel, at most four or five years later, Genghis Khan died, but in real history, this was actually 20 years apart.
When dealing with such technical problems, the compilation of the chronicle is faced with many difficult choices. However, if the chronicle is not sensitive to historical nodes, the readers may not be aware of the efforts behind it, so it is also somewhat thankless.
New Weekly: In Jin Yong's martial arts novels, except for Yue Nv Jian, which happened in the pre Qin period, the rest happened in the Song, Yuan, Ming and Qing dynasties. What is the reason for this?
Xinyuanping: First of all, the society of aristocratic families from the Han Dynasty to the Tang Dynasty has a profound contradiction with the spirit of equality in modern martial arts novels. After the Song Dynasty, when entering the civilian society, people did not pay much attention to their family background and pedigree, which is more in line with the era background of the narrative of "young people with ordinary qualifications, get martial arts scripts, and become a generation of experts".
The civilian society is also characterized by strong mobility. The unified Central Plains Dynasty has developed waterways, and the rivers and canals extending in all directions can make some gangs and powerful people far away from the control of the government, with a more "Jianghu" flavor.
(Picture/Legend of the Carving Hero)
In addition, during the nearly one thousand years of the Song, Yuan, Ming and Qing Dynasties, national foreign aggression has never been cut off. For many readers, the national feelings and family and country feelings contained in Jin Yong's novels are particularly compatible.
However, recent years may be different. Nowadays, many young people find it difficult to replace the feeling of poverty and weakness.
New Weekly: This observation is very interesting. Previously, people thought that the "Jin Yong craze" from the 1980s to the early 21st century was just related to the introduction and publication of Jin Yong's works at that time. Now think about it, it is indeed a kind of reading that echoes the mood of the times.
Xin Yuanping: The world constructed by Jin Yong's novels and the flavor of the times presented by them are subtly consistent with the social environment at that time. After the reform and opening up, there are many opportunities in the society, which are both mobile and uncertain. A generation of young people grow up savagely in the society, and they may become rich overnight or lose their money. This makes the Jianghu world especially dangerous and charming.
Young people don't like Jin Yong's works anymore?
New Weekly: You mentioned that the most heartfelt conversation with "Jin Yong fans" took place on a night train in the early 21st century. At that time, Jin Yong's works were just a sharp tool for ice breaking communication between strangers, which is hard to imagine today.
Is Jin Yong's desolation of swordsmen more due to the development of the times, or is the influence of swordsmen literature not as optimistic as the "Jin scholars" once expected?
Xinyuanping: In the past ten years, Jin Yong and even the martial arts culture have shown a general trend of decline, which is no need to hide. The post-80s generation is greatly influenced by Jin Yong. The next generation of post-90s and post-00s will gradually reduce their exposure to Jin Yong's works, and there may be a considerable number of them, but this is no longer a topic of public concern, and it is only popular among some people.
This is also related to the changes of the times. In the past, young people looked for jobs after graduation, similar to "wandering the Jianghu after leaving the sect", but now they seem to be more inclined to pass the exam. This preference for "going ashore" is in sharp contrast with the past, which is also one of the reasons for the decline of martial arts culture.
(Picture/Happy Jianghu)
In addition, there is another reason for the big environment - people don't read much now. Under the strong stimulation of short videos, fewer people watch online articles, and traditional novels are more affected.
However, I believe that Jin Yong's works will gradually become classic. Although not everyone can read them, some people will regard them as important literary heritage, like popular novels in history, such as The Count of Monte Cristo and Sherlock Holmes, which still have many readers today.
As for "Jinxue", I dare not say anything about serious academic research, but in the field of mass culture, there will still be influential opinion leaders, such as Liushen Leilei, who can still set off a craze to interpret Jin Yong in this era.
(Picture/The Story of Slaying the Dragon against the Sky)
New Weekly: In recent years, Jin Yong's works seem to have changed from popular to a niche hobby.
Xinyuanping: As mentioned earlier, the number of new generation readers has decreased, resulting in insufficient fresh power. At the same time, my generation, including myself, has gradually entered middle age and is busy with life, unable to read and watch plays as frequently as before.
Although we still have some group discussions about Jin Yong and remain enthusiastic, in general, this circle has become relatively small.
On the contrary, some time ago, a group talked about some details of Harry Potter, which made me very emotional. I have also read Harry Potter once, and some of them are pretty good, but after all, there is no deep mark.
Seeing them talking about magic restraint, spells, horcruxes and so on, I suddenly found that the new generation may have grown up watching Harry Potter, just as we grew up watching Jin Yong's works.
When I went to Universal Studios, I also found that some college students rented clothes from various Hogwarts colleges and clocked in front of the castle, which was very ceremonial for them.
Of course, any popular culture has its life cycle, which does not mean that Jin Yong's novels are inferior to the current popular works. In 10 or 20 years' time, the vitality of many popular things may not be as strong as Jin Yong's literature, which is hard to say.
New Weekly: As for Jin Yong's film and television adaptation, the Hong Kong TVB version in the 1980s and 1990s and the mainland version at the beginning of the 21st century have their own supporters. But why are the recent remakes of Jin Yong's martial arts films always unsatisfactory?
Xinyuanping: I may prefer the TVB version of Jin Yong's drama because I am older. Of course, there are also good remakes in the mainland, such as Zhang Jizhong's version of Tian Long Ba Bu. I also watch some new Jin Yong dramas later, but I often want to compare them with the old version after watching several episodes, and finally review the old version again.
There are many reasons for the decline of Jin Yong's dramas. Taking Chen Xiaochun's version of The Deer Tripod as an example, its success lies in that it is loyal to the original work and not completely copied. The screenwriter has made many additions and plays to the story's integration, which has almost reached a perfect level in its system.
(Picture/The Deer Tripod)
However, in recent years, the popularity of Jin Yong and even the martial arts culture itself is deteriorating, and the ability of the new generation of creative teams to grasp the martial arts is gradually weakening.
In addition, there is the impact of fantasy themes. Now the industrialization of the film and television industry is becoming more and more mature. For example, themes such as fantasy and fairy swordsman also have sects, fighting methods and other plots. It can even be said that it is a variety of martial arts, but it pays more attention to visual effects and the appearance of handsome men and women, which is more enjoyable. In contrast, traditional martial arts dramas are not enough to watch.
Generally speaking, fantasy can set aside reality and create a world of immortals unrelated to reality to meet people's pursuit of happiness and carefree, while martial arts dramas pay more attention to the sense of historical gravity and family and country feelings. However, the current adaptation of Jin Yong's drama is also gradually produced under the framework of idol drama, focusing on fighting effects and fantasy elements, and weakening the presentation of historical and social background. This trend has increased the viewing to a certain extent, but it is also gradually away from the core emotion of the original work.
Jin Yong's swordsman "went to sea",
Why is it harder than Three Bodies?
New Weekly: Two years ago, you published an English version of The Deer Tripod. In the first session, the dialogue between Lu Liuliang, a famous scholar at the end of the Ming Dynasty and the beginning of the Qing Dynasty, and Youzi about "chasing the deer in the Central Plains" and "conquering the Central Plains", there was a large section of literal translation that lacked annotation, and you complained that "sinologists can only understand". Is Jin Yong's "historicism" a double-edged sword that raises the threshold of reading while creating a classical flavor?
Xin Yuanping: The content of ancient Chinese history and culture in Jin Yong's works is relatively high, and it is really difficult to translate it directly, but the translation problem is only an appearance. The deeper reason is that Chinese culture is relatively weak in the global cultural pattern.
Even if our national strength is strengthened now, cultural content with strong national characteristics is often difficult to be widely accepted outside the East Asian cultural circle. For example, it is difficult for ordinary readers to have strong interest in classical literary works such as A Dream of Red Mansions, except for professional literary researchers.
Relatively speaking, Journey to the West tells the story of team adventure and struggle with demons and ghosts, which is easier for foreigners to understand. As for science fiction such as "Three Bodies", the background is set in the present and future, which is closer to the values and worldview of global audiences, so it is easier to cross cultural barriers.
January 28, 2024, Haining, Zhejiang. Outside Jin Yong's former residence stands various devices of martial arts elements. (Picture/Wu Ruichao)
But I can't tell how difficult Jin Yong's novels are. Take Song of Ice and Fire as an example. It is a complete set of chivalry, feudal system and complex family relations rooted in European medieval culture, but it is still popular in China.
In addition to the help of adapting film and television works, there is also a general recognition of the mainstream culture in Europe and the United States. The audience is willing to taste it patiently and gradually understand its charm. If it is written by an Indian, if you can't understand it after reading one or two pages, you may not read it, and the work may not be popular.
New Weekly: You also mentioned that the overseas sales of Jin Yong's novels have always been poor, which is far inferior to science fiction such as Three Body. Is the martial arts culture as its core really "visible only to Chinese people"?
Xinyuanping: The core of traditional chivalry may be different from the modern spirit, but the core is still humanity. Westerners also advocate justice, chivalry and kindness, just as Chinese people can understand chivalry and the character and behavior motivation in medieval literature. This logic is universal, and there are few conflicts in values.
In addition, I am actually optimistic about the overseas dissemination of Jin Yong's works. With the increasing international influence of Chinese culture, Jin Yong's novels, as an inseparable and symbolic symbol, still have many possibilities in the future.
As far as I know, several teams have begun to translate new versions, including Chinese and British Americans. They believe that Jin Yong's works have a large potential market overseas.
Where will swordsmen go in the "post Jinyong" era?
New Weekly: When we discuss Jin Yong's works today, it seems that we no longer put them in a virtual world, but need to combine them with current events. Pure textual research on allusions in Jin Yong's works or discussions on plots are becoming less and less. Now, do young people pursue more "practicality" and "timeliness" in the study of "Jinxue"?
Xinyuanping: This is indeed a huge change of the times. Twenty years ago, there were a group of "Jin Yong nerds" in Tianya Forum who were obsessed with the world of swordsmen built by Jin Yong. Now, people don't care much about the original book itself, but they know more or less about the classic plot and characters in it, so it is particularly suitable for applying to some social hot events. It is also fun to play with spoons. But I also feel a little sorry, because in this process, the charm of the original has also been deconstructed.
New Weekly: In your opinion, in the "post Jinyong" era, is there a "substitute meal" for chivalry literature? Why didn't the wind of "new swordsmen in the mainland" finally blow up?
Xin Yuanping: I'm ashamed. I don't read many works of this kind. I can't give a systematic comment. As far as the limited understanding is concerned, such as "Feng Song", "Gone with the Wind", "Rain Tower Qingge" and so on are all very interesting martial arts writers. As for the coldness of the "new chivalry on the mainland", it is still related to the decline of chivalry culture itself. In addition, some works have not established a unique style, and more or less can see the shadow of Jin Yong and Gu Long. But the basic thread of this kind of creation is still there. I think there will still be works of higher quality and more influence in the future.
(Picture/The Condor Heroes)
New Weekly: At a time when martial arts and even Jin Yong's works are not as popular as before, can our discussion of martial arts culture and chivalrous spirit still play a role in contemporary people's lives?
Xinyuanping: Chivalrous spirit seems awkward in contemporary society. With the intervention of public power and the improvement of the rule of law, when encountering bad people, people are more inclined to "call the police" or solve problems through legal means than to need a chivalrous person to preside over justice, which is a good aspect.
On the contrary, some disputes about justifiable defense will also make ordinary people worry about the use of force, even for resistance or relief.
Perhaps as compensation, the world in some fantasy novels has become more and more predatory. Maybe a passer-by A will be eliminated if he offends the main character. Readers also feel "comfortable", which is completely disconnected from the real society.
New Weekly: Most readers first read Jin Yong's works in primary and secondary school. According to your observation, are the next generation around you still reading Jin Yong's works?
Xinyuanping: The next generation must still be read, but the proportion will not reach the level of our generation. This can also be observed from the sales of books.
Ironically, when we were young, our parents generally opposed us to read martial arts novels. It seemed that we would learn to be bad and would kill and set fire to others.
(Picture/The Story of Slaying the Dragon against the Sky)
However, when this generation becomes parents, many people will arrange their children to watch Jin Yong's works instead.
My child is only seven years old. She is not old enough to read Jin Yong's works. In another four or five years, if she is interested, I will certainly not oppose her to read them, but I will not designate them or write 2000 words after reading them. It is better for a person to find his own interest actively.
New Weekly: If some young people want to read Jin Yong's works from scratch, what is the recommended reading order?
Xin Yuanping: I think we can start with some relatively short works to see whether we like such style and narrative, such as Yue Nv Sword, Snow Mountain Flying Fox, Liancheng Jue, etc. Then we can see the "Three Series of Shooting and Carving", "The Eight Heavenly Dragons", "The Laughing Proud Jianghu", "The Deer Ding Story", etc., "Book Sword Enmity and Vengeance" and "Blue Blood Sword" can be interspersed, It can be seen at any time. If you look at the most classic works at the beginning, and then look at the later ones, you may find it boring.
